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Debussy, clarinet Rhapsody


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Author Topic: Debussy, clarinet Rhapsody  (Read 397 times)
t-p
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« on: April 25, 2012, 03:42:50 pm »

I am expending my knowledge of clarinet repertoire.
I didn't know  that Debussy wrote for clarinet. It was interesting discovery for me.
I think clarinet is relatively late instrument and repertoire that I know is mostly by Weber and modern composers (XX century). I  know Martinu has good sonatina.
Apparently it is very well known piece and is played often for auditions.


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guest2
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« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2012, 12:22:22 am »

I think clarinet is relatively late instrument and repertoire that I know is mostly by Weber and modern composers (XX century).

Don't forget Brahms Madame P!
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Neil McGowan
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« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2012, 08:14:08 am »

Brahms indeed, and also Mendelssohn's sonata, and Schumann's Phantasiestücke Smiley

Add a soprano too, and you have one of the most delightful pieces of the romantic era Smiley

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autoharp
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« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2012, 08:35:36 am »

I think clarinet is relatively late instrument and repertoire that I know is mostly by Weber and modern composers (XX century).
Don't forget Brahms Madame P!

I don't marvel at those Brahms pieces, but I do think those sonatas by Bax and York Bowen are worth a listen.
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guest54
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« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2012, 03:19:38 pm »

There is something just a little indecent about the bringing of an object to one's mouth so as to produce sounds. Performance on the violin, the violoncello, or the pianoforte, requiring as it does the exertion of the upper limbs and fingers, is an altogether manlier and more wholesome manner of proceeding.
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ahinton
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« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2012, 04:10:21 pm »

There is something just a little indecent about the bringing of an object to one's mouth so as to produce sounds. Performance on the violin, the violoncello, or the pianoforte, involving as it does the exertion of the upper limbs and fingers, is an altogether manlier and more wholesome manner of proceeding.
I've heard a few bizarre and absurd things in my life, but this is certainly one of the most incredible of these! Are you seriously contending that the act of playing all wind instruments (woodwind and brass) - apart, perhaps, from those of the flute family where mouths and instruments generally come into direct contact only in flutter-tonging and other "special effects" contexts - presupposes the necessity for some degree of wilful indecency and unwholesomeness on the parts of their executants? How daft is that?! - and why did it not occur to the first person who tried, millennia ago, to create a reed of some kind for the purpose of assisting in the generation of sounds? (as in "I blame that Pan, meself") - and, for that matter, what price the equally bizarre and absurd reference to "manlier" performance in the context of stringed and/or keyboard instruments being played by women?

Do you regard all composers who wrote/write for wind instruments as being somehow by definition as guilty of encouraging indecency and unwholesomeness on the parts of the performers as you appear to deem the performers themselves guilty of such indecency and unwholesomeness?

Mon Dieu, you've really excelled yourself with this one, Mr. G! You could perhaps have capped it only by substituting "in-decent" for "indecent" and "un-whole-some" for "unwholesome"...

Poor Debussy; what nonsense gets written in his name in some quarters!...
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t-p
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« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2012, 10:06:12 pm »

Thank you very much , everyone , for nice comments and interesting suggestions.
I will ask around if people here know Bowen and Bax. I think this might be new repertoire here.
I love Schubert's Shepherd on the Rocks. This is my favourite piece I think.
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guest54
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« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2012, 01:37:15 am »

I've heard a few bizarre and absurd things in my life, but this is certainly one of the most incredible of these!

But Mr. H., is it not impressed upon us all even in the nursery that a) it does not do to bring foreign objects to the mouth ("put that down - dirty!") and b) the blowing, bubbling, et cetera of infant-life - in other words, the production of noise orally - loses its charm after say the second year?

Thus these blown instruments represent the stubborn, untamed, unrefined, unrighteous, dark, unseemly, perverse, cabbalistical aspect of musical expression. Many composers - especially Shtrahfinsky of course but by no means only he - have I think understood this. Just think of Mozart and his trombones!

As Mrs. Carlyle wrote: "There arose a shrill, clear sound; the strange instrument was a 'clarionet.'"
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ahinton
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« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2012, 08:23:26 am »

I've heard a few bizarre and absurd things in my life, but this is certainly one of the most incredible of these!

But Mr. H., is it not impressed upon us all even in the nursery that a) it does not do to bring foreign objects to the mouth ("put that down - dirty!") and b) the blowing, bubbling, et cetera of infant-life - in other words, the production of noise orally - loses its charm after say the second year?
I have not one shread of evidence in support of this but I imagine it to be of no relevance here in any event, since it is most unlikely that any child in a nursery would, if unchecked, pick up a contrabass clarinet and start to try to blow into it to get some sounds.

Thus these blown instruments represent the stubborn, untamed, unrefined, unrighteous, dark, unseemly, perverse, cabbalistical aspect of musical expression. Many composers - especially Shtrahfinsky of course but by no means only he - have I think understood this. Just think of Mozart and his trombones!
Of course they represent nothing of the kind and, if they did, what business did Bach, Mozart (whom you cite) or Brahms have in writing for them?! I've never heard of the other composer whom you mention.

As Mrs. Carlyle wrote: "There arose a shrill, clear sound; the strange instrument was a 'clarionet.'"
Not only does this do nothing to prove your point, it was written by a mere woman, so I'm surprised to observe you quoting it.

Incidentally, seven of the nine threads in this section of the forum relate specifically to wind instruments; I'm surprised that you condone such indecent and unwholesome material on here if you truly believe what you're now telling us...
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Neil McGowan
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« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2012, 11:15:49 am »


I love Schubert's Shepherd on the Rocks. This is my favourite piece I think.


Yes, it's quite marvellous Smiley  If you have a soprano of that kind, another Schubert Lied with an obbligato instrument is Auf dem Strom - with French Horn Smiley

But since you have a clarinetist, I strongly recommend the Schubert fantasy mentioned above - very fine music indeed Smiley
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Neil McGowan
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« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2012, 11:17:07 am »

Mr Hinton - were you ever teased at school by the other boys?  Grin
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« Reply #11 on: April 27, 2012, 11:33:37 am »

Mr Hinton - were you ever teased at school by the other boys?  Grin
No. Nor did I tease anyone else there. The contextual relevance of these facts here is, however, clearly zero. If by your reference you sought to imply that Mr G. was "teasing" anyone with his remarks about wind instruments (which is not necessarily the case, of course), his remarks were a joke of possible amusement value to him alone, I imagine and he would quite possibly have made better use of the time he allocated to posting it had he spent it by listening instead to the recording of that fine and manly performance of Rachmaninov's Third Piano Concerto by Ms Argerich...
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Neil McGowan
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« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2012, 12:01:19 pm »

his remarks were a joke of possible amusement value to him alone,

on the contrary, I'm a wind player myself, and I was duly entertained Wink
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ahinton
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« Reply #13 on: April 27, 2012, 12:08:36 pm »

his remarks were a joke of possible amusement value to him alone,

on the contrary, I'm a wind player myself, and I was duly entertained Wink
Well, I did qualify my observation with the word "possible". So - one wind player has found some entertainment value in Mr. G.'s post. I am happy for you. One non-player didn't. Your reaction to this was to ask a question about an entirely unconnected subject, namely teasing at school. Ah, well; it matters little...
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guest54
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« Reply #14 on: April 27, 2012, 02:31:13 pm »

. . . what business did Bach . . . have in writing for them?!

Indeed Mr. H. I too have been thinking about Bach's glorious trumpets. They are a) powerful and b) quite unstoppable are they not. It is precisely for the sake of those characteristics that he uses them. - And never as far as I know in slow passages, by the way.

They are uncompromising, unrestrained, and all-conquering - "untamed" is the inadequate word I used above; and we see how valuable for certain purposes Bach found these qualities, born of course of the unseemly exertions necessary to their effective utilization.

(And my views as expressed in this thread are perfectly serious.)
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