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Holbrooke disc from CPO (with a major change!)

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kyjo
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« on: November 22, 2012, 03:17:33 pm »

Although this was already posted at UC recently, I thought I'd relay it here:

Unfortunately (to me, at least), instead of recording Holbrooke's Symphony no. 3 "Ships", Howard Griffiths has chosen to record the symphonic poem "The Raven"(which has been recorded before only on a sub-standard Marco Polo CD), along with the Violin Concerto "Grasshopper" and the Auld Lang Sayne Variations. Although a new recording of "The Raven" is needed, I, personally, was hoping more for Symphony no. 3, and this change will lead to a shorter CD :(. Apparently, Mr. Griffiths disliked the Symphony no. 3  because it reminded him too much of Havergal Brian (a composer whom he dislikes) :o ::)! But he is a conductor I admire all the same :). Let's just hope someone, sometime will record the Symphony no. 3!
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Albion
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« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2012, 04:18:39 pm »

Recording is due to take place in January, so, given CPO's erratic (euphemism) release-schedule, it really is anybody's guess as to when the actual disc might appear.

 ::)

I'm also disappointed not to have Symphony No.3 included in the programme - for the life of me, having looked at the score, I can not fathom Griffith's reasoning ...

 :o

... but there it is. Another all-Holbrooke disc will be very welcome, and the orchestra which Adrian Leaper had to contend with for Marco Polo simply wasn't up to making a decent job of The Raven: scratchy strings and wobbly brass really do no composer's music any favours.

 :)
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"A piece is worth your attention, and is itself for you praiseworthy, if it makes you feel you have not wasted your time over it." (Sydney Grew, 1922)
kyjo
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« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2012, 04:57:37 pm »

Oh, sorry for not saying that the recording sessions will take place in January :-[. Thanks, John, for clarifying that :). Like you say, who knows when the actual disc will be released from CPO's apparently massive back pile of CDs ::)...
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Albion
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« Reply #3 on: November 22, 2012, 05:58:33 pm »

I think that the most disappointing thing about Howard Griffith dropping Ships from the prospective programme is that, not withstanding the undoubted excellence of the first disc or the promise of the second one, I really thought that Holbrooke had found another truly committed advocate. I can find nothing in the score to suggest Havergal Brian (not that that would be a bad thing of itself) and therefore the given reason for not including the piece is, the more I dwell on it, frankly bizarre - perhaps George Vass can be interested in the project for Dutton. I'll email Lewis Foreman ...

 :)
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"A piece is worth your attention, and is itself for you praiseworthy, if it makes you feel you have not wasted your time over it." (Sydney Grew, 1922)
kyjo
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« Reply #4 on: November 22, 2012, 06:22:04 pm »

Indeed, John. Dutton would seem to be the perfect team to record more Holbrooke, due to the success of the disc containing the Symphony no. 4 :). A "dream disc" of mine would be the Symphony no. 3 coupled with either the Piano Concerto no. 2 "L'orient" or "Queen Mab" for chorus and orchestra :). But I would seriously doubt if the PC 2 would be as much of a Rachmaninovian wallow as the PC 1 is ;)...
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« Reply #5 on: November 22, 2012, 06:25:29 pm »

Please do,Albion!! :) Dutton seem to be interested in both Brian & Holbrooke,so a Holbrooke symphony that 'sounds like Brian' might appeal to them?! ;D Or maybe,if it sounds that much like Brian ::) ??? Brabbins might be interested?! ;D Or maybe,if it sounds that much like Brian,Naxos could include it in their newly revived HB cycle?!! ::)
And if it really DOES sound like Brian,what a great reason to record it?!! ::) ;D

                                                                            Yours Sincerely
                                                                        A confused music lover! ::)

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kyjo
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« Reply #6 on: November 22, 2012, 06:44:08 pm »

I, for the life of me, cannot figure out why Griffiths would think that anything by Holbrooke would even sound remotely like the music of Havergal Brian ???. Well, both composers were highly original and prolific Englishmen who never exploited any musical affiliations with the "English Pastoral School" of VW, Finzi, Moeran, Warlock etc. Also, both composers have come to light recently with excellent CD recordings. But, we really should respect Mr. Griffiths' opinions, no matter how strange they may seem to us :).
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Albion
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« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2012, 06:45:18 pm »

A "dream disc" of mine would be the Symphony no. 3 coupled with either the Piano Concerto no. 2 "L'orient" or "Queen Mab" for chorus and orchestra

Lovely - the Symphony and the Concerto would probably go very well together, both dating from the mid-late 1920s.

I'll email Lewis Foreman
Please do,Albion!!

Duly done.

 :)
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kyjo
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« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2012, 06:51:57 pm »

Wonderful, John :). Please do get back to us when Mr. Foreman responds-we need anyone and everyone we can to carry the torch for Holbrooke :)!
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cilgwyn
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« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2012, 07:19:25 pm »

I, for the life of me, cannot figure out why Griffiths would think that anything by Holbrooke would even sound remotely like the music of Havergal Brian ???. Well, both composers were highly original and prolific Englishmen who never exploited any musical affiliations with the "English Pastoral School" of VW, Finzi, Moeran, Warlock etc. Also, both composers have come to light recently with excellent CD recordings. But, we really should respect Mr. Griffiths' opinions, no matter how strange they may seem to us :).
Howard Griffiths is certainly entitled to his opinion & we AMF members,ours!! Incidentally,I don't think anyone here has expressed any lack of respect for his viewpoint. We just think it's a bit wierd,that's all! ;D

Never mind,George Vass would be a great choice for Holbrooke 3! :)
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cilgwyn
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« Reply #10 on: November 22, 2012, 07:48:39 pm »

I've located the Symposium cd of music by Joseph Holbrooke,recorded on 78s,recorded (& in some cases,played by) under the supervision of the man,himself! It includes a recording of the final bars of Symphony No3. Quite frankly,I don't think I will learn much from it,but I'll have a listen,anyway! :)
Glad there are some other Holbrooke fans here! I've been intrigued by his music ever since hearing those Marco Polo cds,(I even wrote a fan letter to Gwydion Brooke & got a very nice letter & free Lp back! :)) so I AM grateful to those musicians for that & fair play,I've heard allot worse!

I'm going to wait until cd 2 of the Decca Solti Der Rosenkavalier set finishes first,though! ;D
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« Reply #11 on: November 22, 2012, 09:37:18 pm »

Yes, I've got that Symposium disc too, and it certainly doesn't suggest Havergal Brian to me! More like Edward German! Anyway, what a disappointment: I think that for most of us the symphony was the thing we were most anticipating. I suppose I should remember how much Holbrooke has made it onto disc over the years compared to the situation in, say, 1990, but he still seems to be left behind compared with a lot of other composers, and still is the butt of sweeping comments by critics who've never heard the music.
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cilgwyn
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« Reply #12 on: November 22, 2012, 10:01:57 pm »

Re: the Symposium cd! Talk about a brief snatch! I wonder why they bothered? :( The orchestral 'excerpt' from the finale of Holbrooke's third is conducted by Clarence Raybould is from 1924,I believe? (My eyesight! :o) According to the author of the Symposium booklet notes,Michael Plant;'over use is made of the well known sea shanty 'A Rovin!' He uses the world 'banality'. Has he heard the large chunk that comes before it,I wonder?!! ;D Actually,the sound quality isn't the problem here. I have acoustic recordings of orchestral works made in the early years of the century which are both detailed & suprisingly enjoyable. But this is so brief!!! ??? ::) Having said that,I do quite like what I'm hearing! I want the rest!!!! :( ;D
  By the way,unless you are particularly allergic to old recordings,the Symposium cd is well worth getting. The highlight is probably Doris Vane,singing the 'Cradle Song'. Very moving too! Also,John Coates stirring rendition of 'The Bards Song'! (a spectacular flourish at the close!) The funeral March from Bronwen also sounds very stirring here!
The orchestral extracts are cut,but I can't help wondering whether the vigorous performances here,compare favourably with the Marco Polo performances,despite the antiquity of the recordings?!! Must have a listen,now!
Other tracks include Holbrooke in brief extracts from his Piano Quartet in G minor & (more of curiosity value,really!) playing 'Rangoon Rice Carriers' on the piano!! ;D

Indeed,Jimfin! Edward German in maybe,'Welsh Rhapsody' mode! But I do need to hear the,erm,bit ;D before it,before I can really pass judgement!
Quite nice,though! ;D A pity Howard de Walden couldn't have funded a bit more!! :( I quite like shellac recordings! :) And new digital ones too!!! ;D
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« Reply #13 on: November 23, 2012, 01:57:37 pm »

I would also recommend that Symposium CD highly: it's the only way to hear a reasonable selection from 'The Cauldron of Anwyn' before I win the Lottery. And you can hear Holbrooke as a pianist. I also enjoy acoustic recordings, and the quality of remastered ones has been improving all the time (as with the recently released Elgar ones, almost as clear now as his electric ones)
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kyjo
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« Reply #14 on: November 23, 2012, 03:15:12 pm »

Thanks, cilgwyn and jimfin, for your recommendations of the Symposium CD, which I did not yet acquire because I was a bit doubtful about its quality :). I guess it'll be the only way to hear anything from Symphony no. 3 ;D ::)!
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