The Art-Music, Literature and Linguistics Forum

I went looking for performances of the Sibelius 7th on You Tube.I found a performance from the 2013 Proms with the Mahler Chamber Orchestra conducted by Daniel Harding. Unfortunately the video includes the intro' by the ineffable, dreadful, asinine Katie Derham.

Having commented on Sibelius's later silence as a composer Ms Derham says:

"You know, I always think that it is amazing that Sibelius, who most active as a composer in the late 19th and early 20th centuries, should have lived long enough to hear Elvis Presley".

...and with that thought in one's mind begins one of Sibelius's most profound,beautiful and moving compositions

Am I alone in finding this woman and her ignorant comments insufferable?

No.

I can conjure up the scene in which the aged Sibelius, at home in Ainola outside Jarvenpaa, shouts at his wife to demand a radio so that he can listen to "Rock around the Clock" or some other Presley classic. Who needs to compose in his Finnish hideout when he can listen to the blessed Elvis

The massed ranks of the ghosts of BBC music producers of the past and of the truly great music critics and writers must be whirling manically in their graves If Derham had said "Pierre Boulez" rather than Elvis then her observation, although still trite, would have had a measure of sense but- with due respect to those who might admire Mr. Presley-to mention him in the same sentence, to associate him in any way with the Finnish master, and to do so seconds before the remarkable opening of the symphony with its drum role and the magical entry of the strings is simply rank bad taste. She and her producer should be banished to "Strictly Come Dancing" or some other of the BBC's contributions to its contemporary vision of its Reithian mission

I fear that the egregious Ms Derham has form in this; what you heard was by no means a slip of the tongue...

And another,definite.No! Katie Derham,and her like,is one of the reasons I don't listen to Radio 3 anymore,unless it's something I've seen in the listings,or been alerted to,and wish to record! Yuk!! ::) I had a friend,when I was a youngster,who used to torture me with his massive Elvis collection. Now,I'm in my fifties,I quite enjoy the odd,more up-tempo Elvis hit,if caught accidentally on the radio. I'm not a fan,though. I think he was massively overrated and his slow numbers were dreadful! If you like that sort of thing,I think there were better rock and rollers! (I remember quite enjoying watching Chuck Berry,at Xmas,I think?!) I suppose it's just that,from this distance in time,whatever I think of him,he just seems a bit better than the people they call pop stars,now! Fair play! :o ;D The nearest Sibelius got to rock being granitic monoliths like the Seventh. Mind you the idea of Sibelius sitting listening to Elvis in his armchair does evoke amusing mental pictures! Sibelius rocking around the clock!! ;D (The clock strikes two,Sibelius two.....doop-doop-shooboodi-wap!!) ;D ;D (Bill Haley,of course)

Yes.. this is a really stupid remark!   In 50 years, people will have to google the name Elvis to see the meaning of that word.  That remark is really inappropriate.

Can we avoid pursuing the imagine which you (and, of course, I too) conjured up ;D It is too preposterous ::)

Someone on Musicweb suggested that I should just laugh it off to save myself from dying of apoplexy ;D

Easier said than done! I shall continue to rail against the dimming of the light :)

An egregious violation of house rules (prohibiting personal vituperation) this thread, - and instigated by a surprising party.

I am, of course, perfectly happy to delete the entire thread or alternatively to move it to the "unmoderated forum" if required to do so.

My reading of the Rules is that vituperative comment directed at another member is prohibited as is derogatory comment on the moral character of musicians (and by implication anyone associated with music.) There has certainly in the past been extremely harsh comment on the published opinion of certain music critics.

I have no wish to impugn Ms Derham's personal character which is no doubt exemplary, nor to question her motivation in attempting, in however maladroit fashion, to relate the life and career of a great composer to a figure from the world of "popular culture" whom she seems to believe should have some significance for listeners. Unfortunately, as Alistair has observed, she has previous "form" in coming out with statements on a national broadcasting network which are, in my opinion and that of others, (yes) asinine and (I found) actually offensive. A former BBC producer told me that those remarks would have been completely unacceptable in his time.

I am more than happy to clarify that my harsh words and strictures relate to the comments made by the lady and not to her herself!

.....but I shall certainly defer to others if my comments are regarded as incendiary and unacceptable.  ::)

I have witnessed much the same thing in Canada over the past 15 or 20 years or so.  Since the CBC went to a more "mainstream" (for want of a better way of putting it) format this seems to be the required style for classical music hosts.  It isn't that the hosts are themselves uneducated or ill-informed - many of them are in fact themselves actively performing classical musicians.  But the music can't be presented without some sort of contemporary flavored, gossipy, Entertainment Tonight style reference to some supposedly titillating aspect of the composer's life.  I dunno, maybe this is the way to give the younger, contemporary audience exposure to "the Masters", but personally I have my doubts.

Brian

I'm still surprised that Radio 3 hasn't made more of the undoubted talents of Myleene Klass!

Oh, purLEEESE! Don't given them ideas...

I remember reading that Myleene Klass was a keen astronomer,and that she wouldn't mind presenting Sky at Night given the chance. I think someone even suggested that she might be a possible candidate. I haven't watched it since Patrick Moore died;but,as far as I know,the offer hasn't been taken up?!
Incidentally,I remember one evening,flicking through the tv channels,and finding her on three in a row. I started to panic,thinking she might be on every single one!! :o ;D

Who on earth are you talking about??? Myleene who? I genuinely have never heard of this person!

Haven't heard of Myleene Klass?!! :o ;D How fortunate!! Not that I'm a follower! She just seemed to be ubiquitous on every channel a while back;presenting various tv and radio shows. All you seemed to hear about was how clever she was and how she loved classical music,even playing classical piano herself. The BBC seemed particularly keen on promoting her. I did try to avoid her,by switching over;but she just seemed to pop up on the channel I was watching. Perhaps it's like that person you meet. You've never seen them before,but suddenly you seem to bump into them everywhere you go! Even if you don't like them! They seem to have lost interest in her lately,however! Although,I mustn't speak too soon!!

Alan Titchmarsh is another presenter who seems to pop up on classical music programs and has presented some concerts. He has a sideline in gardening,I gather!

I suppose it's an age "thing"! But I'll admit,I do like the old fashioned kind of presenter,who just seemed to introduce a concert and fill you in with a few pertinent details about the composer and the composition. I don't need to know how delightful it is,or whether the composer lived to see the era of the Sex pistols,or Doris Day,for that matter! ;D They don't have to sound plummy,though!! ;D For that I can listen to the spoken introductions to some of the files uploaded to our music archive here.

I don't have a problem with popular music,I might add. I'm listening to the seventies (mainly) soul singer Millie Jackson at the moment! (No relation to Michael!!) Her album,Caught up, being regularly cited by critics as one of the greatest and most influential soul albums ever. I'm a big fan of her singing! Elvis.........not so much!! ::) ;D

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I should point out that I don't mind the inclusion of some useful nuggets of information and input from someone with something genuinely interesting to say about a composer;or a snippet of an interesting interview. I remember a performance of Bush's Piano concerto (I taped it,I think the Piano Concerto is here?) with a snippet of John Amis talking about the composer,and how as a long standing communist and supporter of the Soviet Union,in a poignant interview with Amis,suffering from Alzheimers,he didn't even know that the iron curtain had fallen! Another instance. A snippet of Daniel Jones talking about Dylan Thomas (I think?) before a relay of one of his symphonies. Also,eading that Havergal Brian enjoyed The Beatles (I don't! :o ;D) I might add is interesting and amusing. It shows how open minded he was to new trends. Although,he didn't go as far as Malcolm Arnold and Deep Purple!! ;D I don't think he liked Elvis,though?!! Even if he did show some early promise,so much of his later output is so crass and vulgar! ::) I mean Elvis,not Brian,of course!! ;D

Bring back Patricia Hughes!

There is a nice story about how she got the job of announcer on Radio 3. She turned up for an audition and was asked to read a programme schedule, which was full of things like "Stanisław i Anna Oświecimowie" by Mieczysław Karłowicz, which she stumbled through, making a total hash of it as one might expect coming across it unprepared. So she was rather surprised to be told she'd got the job. "But I pronounced everything wrongly!" she said. "Ah," she was told, "You were the only one who read through to the end."

!!! That would have to be from the dead, of course, as she sadly departed some 4½ years ago at the age of 90.

I know ... wishful thinking. I was a fan of Tom Crow as well. I always remember the time that a concert programme was re-arranged by moving one piece from the second half to the first half. Unfortunately, they didn't tell the bass clarinettist, who thought he was not needed for the first half and timed his arrival at the concert hall accordingly. The concert was being broadcast live, so Crow had to keep up some sort of continuity on air while the hall was being scoured for the missing instrumentalist. It must have been agony, but he did as well as could be expected.

This will mean nothing to anybody outside Canada, of course, but I cherish the memory of Bob Kerr who used to host a program on CBC FM called "Off the Record".  Knowlegeable and informed about the music, Bob also had an inquisitive side, as reflected by his programming of such (then) novel and unknown composers as Eduard Tubin.  He also had a few unique personal preferences.  For example, although I never figured out the connection, he would always program Nielsen's "Sinfonia Espansive" on (Canadian) Thanksgiving Day.  By contrast, most current CBC classical announcers seem to have no purpose other than to appeal to a younger demographic.  As I said before, I have no idea how that's working for them.